<p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>The interview of&nbsp; S&eacute;bastien Morvan &ndash; the co-founder of BBP</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>布鲁赛尔啤酒计划创始人-</strong><strong>塞巴斯蒂安</strong><strong>&nbsp;</strong><strong>莫凡<strong>&nbsp;</strong>访谈</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>我们想大概地了解你的个人经历,然后是你们这个项目所有的关键观念,譬如虚拟现实、社区等等。我们的第一个问题是,你是如何从一位&ldquo;投资银行家&rdquo;变成了一位&ldquo;社会企业家&rdquo;?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:22岁时,我就在伦敦的一家大公司工作,非常光鲜,对我来说也有些吸引力。但是,在那儿工作了几年后,我离开了。因为在那里,我并不开心,也并不为我所做的事情而感到骄傲。当然我赚了不少钱,社会地位也高,但我所做的事情缺乏意义,缺少意味。我想填补这种空虚,想把意义和激情带回到我的生活。于是,工作三年后,我抛弃了这一切,来了个一百八十度的转变。我背上背包,告别这个世界,去了拉丁美洲,去了布宜诺斯艾利斯,在当地的一个从事小额贷款的NGO工作,帮助当地的社区居民获得电力。与伦敦的工作相比,做这件事情,让我开心得多也&ldquo;富有&rdquo;得多。我告诉自己,做能让我热衷并快乐的事情;做既对我有意义,也对我身边的人有意义的事情,这才是我要选择的道路。这是我所坚持的人生之旅的起点。而现在,这件事是布鲁塞尔啤酒计划。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>First, we start with your personal experience, then we turn to your ideas, like virtual reality, community, all the keys of your project. The first question is why and how you changed your career from an investment banker to social entrepreneur?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">S: &nbsp;I started when I was 22, started it in a big company in London, because it was all shining you know, and a little bit attractive, so I started to work there for few years, but I left because I wasn&#39;t happy nor proud about what I was doing. I got some money of course, the social status was good, but what I was doing lacked sense, it lacked meaning and I wanted to fill that void and bring meaning &amp; passion to my life. After three years, I just left it all on the side and did a&nbsp;<em>one-eighty</em>&nbsp;shift. And I just took my bag and said good bye to this world and went to Latin America, and Buenos Aires, where I started to work for a NGO in micro-finance, that was all about community and trying to help people get electricity. Then I felt so much happier about what I was doing, so in the way I was richer doing this than what I was doing in London. I told myself that&rsquo;s the way going forward for me was to do something I enjoy, follow my passion, and do something that makes sense for me and for people around me, that was the start of a long journey that I carry on, now with the Brussels Beer Project.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>你从阿根廷的金融危机学到了什么?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:阿根廷的金融危机让这个曾经富裕的国家陷入了相当程度的贫困,尤其对穷人来说,他们失去了就业机会,失去了工作,失去了收入,谋生、养家都变得很困难,他们是泡沫破裂的牺牲品。仍然得说,从我的位置尽力提供帮助,要好过混迹于大公司的世界。一直以来,我都想创造属于我自己的事业,我来自一个满是企业家的家族,我的父亲是企业家,我的祖父是企业家,我的哥哥也是,所以,在我的血管里,在我的DNA里,有一种创业精神。大约十二年前,在加拿大留学时,我有幸遇到了同在加拿大读书的奥利维耶(Olivier)。那时候,加拿大已经有了非常好的&ldquo;现代精酿啤酒&rdquo;。当时我们有共同创造、实现激情的想法,但我们太年轻了,才二十一、二岁。所以我们分开了,各自在不同的国家做不同的工作。后来,我们依然决定,共同实现年轻时的梦想。离开既有的工作,舒适的生活,扎入陌生的事情并非易事,但是,我们想尝试,尝试和这里的社区一起实现它。当然,对我们来说,最重要的是开始做,从零开始,一步一步地,和我们社区一道,以一种非常有力的颠覆性方式对待比利时的啤酒世界。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>&nbsp;What did you learn from Argentina&#39;s financial crisis?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">S:&nbsp; Yeah, indeed, there was a crisis in Argentina that at some point created a lot of poverty in Argentina who used to very wealthy, and affluent, and it was very hard especially for of course the poor people, who got no employment any more, losing their jobs, losing their money, had a hard time to get a living, and be able to feed their family, so they were the victims of bubble that had exploded&hellip;and again, I felt more at my place to try to help, rather than to be in the corporate world. And for a long time, I wanted to create my own project, I also come from a family of entrepreneurs, my dad is an entrepreneur, my granddad was an entrepreneur, my brother is an entrepreneur, so I really have that in my blood, in my DNA&hellip; and I was very lucky to meet&nbsp;Olivier&nbsp;in Canada about twelve years ago now, we were studying together in Canada where there was already very good craft beer, modern day craft beer. We exchanged about creating something together around our passion we were too young, only 21, 22. So we worked a few years, him and I, in different countries, different companies and then we decided to unite strength and actually pursue our dream. Not an easy choice to leave your job, to leave a comfortable life, to dive into something you don&#39;t know, but, yeah, we wanted to try, and build it with a community here, it was also of course essential for us to make it, to start from scratch, little by little, with our community, with a very strong and&nbsp;disruptive&nbsp;way to look at the beer world here in Belgium.&nbsp;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>有趣。你们是怎么想到虚拟现实、社区这些概念的?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:从一开始,当我们决定开始自己的项目和酿酒厂的时候,我们就很清楚,我们并不想和其他人一样,不想照比利时或世界其他的酿酒师剪剪贴贴。而且,我们也不认同比利时是&ldquo;啤酒博物馆&rdquo;这种简单的看法,你知道,所谓的博物馆,总是流连在老派,旧时光和传统方法当中,而我们想做的是,告别中世纪,奔向21世纪。我们想展示比利时、布鲁塞尔也是与时俱进的,它还活着,有尝新的胆量,所以,我们想和人们,和社区一道来尝试改变它。布鲁塞尔有这么多的酿酒厂,这么多好的酿酒师,但我们觉得他们大多都过于传统,而我们则是从不同的角度切入的,我们有这样一种手工2.0&mdash;&mdash;共同创造的概念,意思是,我们想尽可能地共同合作,尽可能地和啤酒爱好者,同比利时、其他国家的其他酿酒师共同合作。我们有机会和巴西、挪威、伦敦、巴黎、维布勒、日本东京的酿酒师合作酿酒,交换想法,和艺术家们合作,我们喜欢这些广泛延伸的创造性工作。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">共同创造的另外一部分,是创新;布鲁塞尔的酿酒师可能每五年才酿一款新品,而我们则是两周的频率,我们对口味充满激情,我们乐于发现新的口味,让我们的社区参与到这口味的冒险当中来,所以我们从零开始,事实上,我们就是和几个朋友在这个车库里开始的,产量很小,起初我们酿了四款样品&mdash;&mdash;阿尔法、贝塔、伽马和德尔塔,然后我们在比利时广而告之,请人们来品尝,来参加我们的品酒会,小型的品酒会,会上我们跟在场者介绍我们的啤酒,我们的项目,我们想做什么,你们可以选择你们中意的那一款,然后,他们明智地选择了德尔塔,一款至今还是我们的销量冠军的啤酒,也就是我手上的这一款。这也是一种很美妙的方式,因为它象征了我们在这款啤酒中想实现的东西,它有赛松酵母,有比利时的根源,与此同时,它也有新世界的灵感,所以,我们使用了不同的技术,譬如不同的酿造技术,来自全世界不同角落的酒花,所以,我们的想象,关于共同创造的想象都概括在这款啤酒里了。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Interesting. How did the idea of virtual of reality, community, come into your mind?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">S: Well, the main thing when we decided to start our own project and brewery, we say we don&#39;t want to do like everyone else does, we don&#39;t want to copy-paste brewers from Belgium or from any other parts of the world. We also didn&rsquo;t like the idea of Belgium being reduced to a &ldquo;museum of beer&rdquo;, you know, where it&#39;s just about the old school, the old days, and the old fashion way of making beer, we want to say hello to the 21st century, and goodbye to the Middle Ages. We want to show that Belgium, and Brussels is there, and it&#39;s also modern, and it&#39;s alive, and it&#39;s daring new things, so, and we want to do that with people, with a community. In Belgium, you have so many breweries, so many brewers, and you also have a lot of good brewers, but we feel like that too many of them are traditional, we come with a completely different angle, we come with this craft 2.0, with idea of co-creation, meaning that we want to be as collaborative as possible, collaborative with the public, with beer lovers, with people who are interested in the beer, collaborative with other brewers, from Belgium, from other countries, we have the chances to brew in Brazil, in Norway, in London, in Paris, in&nbsp;V&egrave;bre,&nbsp;in Japan as well, in Tokyo, exchange ideas, collaborative with all the artists, &nbsp;also we love all of these extended work of creation.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">And the second part of co-creation of course is innovation, so while you have brewers in Belgium that brew maybe one new beer in five years, we brew a new beer every two weeks, so we are passionate about taste, we are passionate about discovering, new tastes, making our community involve in this adventure of taste, so we started from scratch, we actually started from brewing with my friends in this garage, it was very little production, we had four proto-beers at the beginning, we had Alpha, Beta, Gamma and Delta, we just say to people here in Belgium to come, to our tasting, small tasting sessions, we talked to you about beers, about the project, about what we want to do,&nbsp; and you will pick the beers you prefer, and they had the good choice to pick Delta, which is still our number one beer today,&nbsp; it&#39;s the beer here, Delta. And it&#39;s also a nice way because it symbolizes what we want to do with this beer, it has&nbsp;Saison&nbsp;yeast, it has this Belgium roots, and at the same time, it has a lot of this new world&#39;s inspirations, so, we work with different kinds of techniques, in terms of brewing, we work with different hops coming from different regions of the world, so in this beer you encapsulate our vision, our vision of co-creation.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>你们特别的创新之处在哪里?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:我想,在比利时,我们有点儿像异类,怪物。你有你的道路,但我们选择了另一条。我们所做的一切,这个项目的DNA,是重新发明它自身,从一而终,挑战现状。根本上来说,我们想一直创新,创造新的概念,所以&mdash;&mdash;理所当然&mdash;&mdash;我们是从我们和社区营造中的身份建构开始,和人们一道创新,一道筹措资金。就像我们说过的,布鲁塞尔人选择口味,给酿酒师提供资金,他们对我们所做的事情有发言权,所以,这里头有一种⋯⋯这也是一种民主的酿造⋯⋯此外,我们对所有其它的事情都怀有兴趣。比方说&ldquo;巴比伦&rdquo;,它非常特别,因为它是第一款食物啤酒,在这款酒中,我们对面包进行再利用,用面包酿酒。我们也和艺术家合作,酒配音乐,口味配声音,利用联觉进行跨感官实验,所以,我认为我们并不仅仅是一家酿酒厂,我们并不仅仅只是酿酒,我们融入了很多概念,啤酒是我们的媒介。所以,我认为,我们并非像祖辈父辈那样的酿酒厂,我们有完全不同的观点和角度,我们并不受制于传统,我们感觉有一股新的气息将我们推向新的领域,这也是让我们激动的东西,尝试新的东西,让自己处于险境,走出舒适地带,这是我们感受自己的生命的方式,这是我们的一切。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>What makes you so distinguishable in terms of innovation?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">I think we are a little bit of&nbsp;an alien here in Belgium, we are the odd animal. You have a path, and we take another one. In about&nbsp;everything what we do, it&#39;s the DNA in the project, it&#39;s to reinvent itself, all the time, always challenge the status quo, always, and so by nature we want to be innovative, and come up with new concepts, so we started of course with the still number one piece of identity that we have started with the community-building, make it with the people, collaborative in terms of the crowd-sourcing, as we say, people chose the taste, in terms of crowdfunding, have the brewers funded by the people of Brussels, they have voice in what we do, so there is a way&hellip; it&#39;s democratic brewery also here&hellip;but also we are interested in whole kinds of things. Babylon for instance was very special in the way they are the ever first food waste beer to be created, so in this beer we recycle breads and make beer out of bread. We worked with some artists as well, on music pairing, so associating taste and sound, working on the synesthesia, so it&#39;s like the cross of this sensorial experiment, and I&rsquo;d like to think we are not just a brewery, we don&#39;t just make beers, we work a lot of conceptual ideas, also use beer as a medium. So I think, maybe it is also the fact that we are not just brewers from grandparents and parents and so on, we come with a completely different view, and angle, and we don&#39;t feel the weight of the traditional, and we show this, we feel the fresh breeze pushing us to new unexplored territories, that is also what excites us, it is to try new things, to put ourselves at risk, to get out of your comfort zone, this is the way we feel our life, this is what we are all about.&nbsp;&nbsp;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>你们开辟新疆域的时候遇到了哪些困难?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:是的,不容易,但迄今为止我们很开心,因为项目顺风顺水,冒险也令人享受,非常幸运,我们得到了布鲁塞尔、比利时甚至国外的啤酒爱好者们的支持,从大家那里获得了如此多的能量,所以,得到这些支持,让我们感到非常幸运。当然,有些传统的酿酒师,对我们所做的事情,我们所使用的技术,以及我们颠覆性的方法不太高兴,所以我们也受到了很多(批评):你不应该这么做,规则不是这样的。但你说的规则是什么样的?你所说的是你自己的规则,不是我的。我当然不会遵循你的规则,因为我有完全不同的罗盘,我有自己的方向,所以我们也受到了一些传统酿酒师的批评,尤其是在布鲁塞尔。但是我们把这当作是一种补充。因为你要是没有让其他人不安,那就意味着你所做的并没有什么大不同,当然,如果我们只是和其他人一样,做同样的事情,那么我们就不会受到这么多批评。事实上,我们会把批评当作补足,把这种负能量转化成正能量。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Are there any difficulties for you when you started something completely new?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Well, yeah, it&#39;s not easy, we are very happy because so far it has been a very good right, very enjoyable adventure, we were so blessed to get support from the community of beer lovers in Brussels, in Belgium, even abroad, to get so much energy coming from the public at large, so we are very blessed by all these supports. Of&nbsp; course, some brewers, traditional brewers, were not so happy with what we do, the technique we use, and our disruptive approach, so we got a lot of also&hellip;you should not do this, this is not the rules. But what kind of rule you talking about? You&#39;re talking about your own rule, not my rule, it&#39;s your rules, not mine. So of course, I&#39;m not going to follow yours, because I have a completely different set of compass, I have my own direction, so we got some criticism from the traditional brewers, especially here in Belgium. But we take that as complement. Because it means if don&#39;t disturb anybody, it means you don&#39;t do much different from anybody else, so, of course, if we were just doing like all the people,&nbsp;the same&nbsp;as everybody else, we will get much less criticism. In fact, we now take criticism as compliment and we try to transform this negative energy into positive energy!</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>那么你们的&ldquo;正能量&rdquo;获得了什么反响呢?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:反响非常不错⋯⋯我们又一次获得了很多支持。刚开始时,我们只有四款样品,我们邀请人们前来品尝我们的酿造,一天之内,所有的品酒会都定满了!我们有七场小型品酒会以及一场盛大的闭幕会。人们怀着热情而来,他们对这个新的计划充满了好奇。从第一天开始,也就是人们选择了&ldquo;德尔塔&rdquo;之后,我们说,嘿,如果你喜欢这款啤酒,如果你喜欢这个项目,就请资助这个计划,有三百零九位来宾说,好,我们来一起做,我们来支持你们,我们就是这样开始的。现在我们有两千五百位支持者资助酿酒厂,比先前多了很多。但是,不,我认为尽管比利时有着很悠久的啤酒文化历史,但让人惊讶的是,直到今天人们仍然这么好奇,乐于探索⋯⋯他们非常渴望学习、品尝新事物,这让人感到惊讶,我们是2013年开始的,每一年我们都很惊奇地看到,同样的这些人总是在更新他们对精酿啤酒的知识和热情,因为他们对啤酒有着完全不同的观点和想法,我们很乐于帮助他们去发现新的想法,这样,它引起了我们很大的好奇心,也让我们感到很骄傲。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>So how do people respond the &quot;positive energy&quot;?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Very well&hellip;We&#39;ve been blessed again by all these supports. When we started, when we had just like four prototypes, we invited people to come and taste what we did and in one day, all the tasting sessions were all booked! We had seven small sessions and a big final event. People came with a lot of enthusiasm and they are all very curious about this new project. From the day one, just after selecting Delta, we say, hey, if you like the beer, if you like the project, please help fund the project, we have three hundred and nine people say, ok, let&#39;s do it, let&#39;s support you, that was from the start. Now we have two thousand five hundred people who fund the brewery, so it&#39;s much more. But, no, I think, even though in Belgium you have a long history of beer culture, what&#39;s amazing is to see still today how curious people are to explore for the&hellip;they are very thirsty to learn, to explore, to taste new things, and it&#39;s amazing to see, we started in 2013, it&#39;s amazing to see, year after year, the same people developing the knowledge and&nbsp;passion of craft&nbsp;beer, because now they have completely different view of beer, idea of beer, and we like the idea to thinking that we also play a role in helping them to see new idea of beer, so it creates a lot of curiosity, a lot of pride for us.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>身份:参与计划的都是谁?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:每一个人。我们在社交媒体上发布了公开召集令,当然,都是朋友的朋友,朋友的朋友们,口口相传,就这样,我们并没有说,嘿,你能来,而你不能来,所以,在我们的社区里,我们有二十多岁的年轻人,也有三四十岁的人,甚至还有老奶奶,我们没有任何限制&mdash;&mdash;只要你有品赏啤酒的精神,所以,我们的团体是非常兼收并蓄的。当然,因为我们所做的事情的性质,我们所吸引的大多数都是更年轻的人,但不全部是。我真的很喜欢我们的活动,品酒会上有这种年纪的人,有一家子,小孩子们到处跑,这带来了一种家庭氛围,那是我们想保持的,更像一个家庭,而不只是纯洁的,嬉皮似的酷潮流,我们要更加开放,嗯,更像是家庭。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Identity: who are the people that came in this project?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">It&#39;s everybody, yeah, we made a call, a public call on social media, of course, it&#39;s friends of friends, friends of friends of friends, and it started the words of mouth, it started like this, but we didn&#39;t say that, hey you can come, and you cannot come, so in our community we have people who are twenty something young, we have thirty, forty, we even have grandmother, so we are not restrictive as long as the spirit is appreciating beer there, so we have a very&nbsp;eclectic&nbsp;group of people, of course, by the nature of what we do, we have attracted mostly the younger crowd, but not exclusively. And I really like at our events, when you have all kinds of ages represented in the tasting events, and you have like families, like more kids running around, so it creates a very family atmosphere, and that&#39;s what we want to keep, it&#39;s more like this family thing, it&#39;s not just about pure, hippy style cool trendy thing, it&#39;s more open than that, eh, it&#39;s&hellip;ya, it&#39;s more family.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>看到有关&ldquo;家庭氛围&rdquo;的文章时,我们有一个问题,会为孩子酿酒吗?可是他们是被禁止饮酒的⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:没有,没有,当然没有,我的意思是,有很多父母会拍假装他们的孩子在喝酒的照片,当然,我说孩子们跑来跑去的时候,我是在说这些父母感到这里的气氛很舒服,所以会带孩子来,因为我们的活动不是为了拼酒,你知道,让你不醒人事,胡作非为。我们的活动是为了轻松欢乐,是为了一起开心,是为了分享和品尝。如果父母也会带孩子来,我觉得是个好的迹象,因为他们觉得很酷,他们很自信,他们信任这个社区,所以会让孩子跑来跑去,我认为这是一个很好的迹象。但他们不会喝酒⋯⋯好吧,只喝那么一点点&nbsp;☺。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>When we read about this, we have a question, for kids? but kids are forbidden&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Yes, no, no, of course, I mean there are photos of parents pretending the kids are drinking, of course, when I&#39;m saying the kids are running around I&#39;m saying that the parents feel comfortable to bring their kids in our events, because our event is not about how much you drink, you know, you get wasted, you do crazy stuff&hellip;in our events, it&#39;s about conviviality, it&#39;s about having fun together, it&#39;s, yeah, it&#39;s about sharing and tasting. I think it&#39;s a very good signal if young parents feel cool to bring also their kids run around, they feel confident, and they have the trust in the community to let the kids run around, so I think it&#39;s a very good signal. But they don&#39;t drink&hellip;well, just a little bit ☺</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>在这个街区,有一种明显的创新氛围,你们选择这里是有特别的考虑的吧?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:当然,位置是非常重要的,因为我们也想加入这个街区,成为其中一部分,位置对于计划的身份而言是非常重要的,我们很高兴来这儿,原因有很多。 Dansaert街,也就是我们所在的这条街,在布鲁塞尔,在比利时,因为对创意天才的吸引力而著名。他们当中有设计师,服装设计师,这里有很多音乐会,包括爵士音乐会,还有很多另类音乐的演出。这条街很有趣,最开始的时候主要是设计、服饰等等,有那么一点高端,这里,河道的西边,也就是我们所在的区域,则更多是生活方式,爵士、美食,当然还有上好的啤酒,这里有很好的氛围,当然,对我们来说,感受你们所注意到的这种氛围是非常重要的;第二个有趣之处是,几十年前,这一带曾有很多酿酒厂,而在其中,有一家百年前叫做Bredeal的酿酒厂,而在河道另一边,几米外开的地方,还有当时全国最大的酿酒厂之一Bellevue,所以,这一代有着很丰富的酿厂历史,当然,现在它们都不在了,因为要在市中心酿酒太难了,但我们想复兴都市酿酒场景,我们喜欢这个想法。与Dansaert平行的rue du houblon是酒花街,这条街一直到今天仍叫这个名字,今天你仍可以在这条街上看到酒花厂,所以,这里感觉就像是我们的家一样。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Thank you. So we walk around this area, we can feel the air of innovation, do you have any special consideration of choosing this as your location?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Of course, the location is very important because also we want to be part of the neighborhood, and the location is very important for identity of beer project, we are very happy to be here for many reasons. Dansaert street, the street we are on, is quite famous in Brussels, in Belgium, for attracting creative talents. They could be designers, clothes designers, you have a lot of concerts as well Jazz concerts, you know, and alternative music playing. Actually it&#39;s a fun street, at the beginning of this street it&#39;s mostly design, clothing and so on, a little bit more upscale, and here we are&nbsp;on the best to the cannel, it&#39;s more about lifestyle, about Jazz, about good food, about good beer of course, and we have very nice vibe here, and it&#39;s of course very important for us to feel this creative vibe as you noticing; and second thing is fun because back few decades ago, there used to be brewers around here, so actually just where the breweries, there used to be a brewery one hundred years ago called &ldquo;Bredael&rdquo;, and there used to be one of the biggest brewery in the country just across the canal &ldquo;Bellevue&rdquo; it&#39;s just few meters away, so in the neighborhood you have lots of history of breweries, now of course they have gone because it&#39;s harder to be in center of Brussels, but we like the idea that we are reviving the urban brewery landscape. Actually the parallel street of Dansaert is called &ldquo;rue du houblon&rdquo; which means the hops streets, because that is where the brewers in Brussels they used to buy hops, so It&#39;s called till today the hop street you know, and you still see hop plants on the street, so we feel like this is home for us.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>这一带还有其他的酿酒厂吗?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:六年前,五六年前这里还有一家,是一个叫做Cantillon的百年老店,是那时唯一的幸存者,很漂亮,很小,很传统的一家酿酒厂,然后,现在,它开始复兴了,布鲁塞尔开始重生,我们是回来的第一家,我认为在接下来的几年里,布鲁塞尔可能出现五六家酿酒厂,相比过去,这不算多,但我希望这可以激励更多人在布鲁塞尔,在比利时开厂,我们希望我们也能够帮助人们重启他们的雄心,我们有点儿像大哥,帮助他们获得更多的经验和&ldquo;午餐&rdquo;,我觉得,当代布鲁塞尔有着催生更多酿酒厂的潜力,因为这里有很多天才,很多文化,我们所要做的,只是让它发生。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>So are there still any other breweries here?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Just maybe six years ago, five or six years ago, there was only one brewery, that was &ldquo;Cantillon&rdquo; which is one-hundred-year old brewery, which was the last brewery to survive, it&#39;s beautiful, small traditional brewery, then it started to come back to life, Brussels started come back to life, we are one of the first to go back, and now I think in a couple of years, you will have maybe six or seven breweries in Brussels, which is not so much compared to what we could have, and I hope that in some way we also inspire other people to start their breweries in Brussels, in Belgium, and we hope we can also help people would restart their motivation, we are a little bit big brother for them to get more experience and lunch because I felt in modern area for sure there are potentials for much more breweries in Brussels, there are a lot of talents, there is a lot of culture and we just need to make it happen.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>你们在为啤酒制造新的面孔,新的口味,新的⋯⋯你们也在尝试&ldquo;联觉&rdquo;,可否详解?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:这是我们现在所聚焦的领域,我们正将之付诸实施。我们聊聊胃理学( Gastrophysics )和联觉,这是一种跨感官经验,我们可以尝试音乐配对,譬如,将声音和你的啤酒搭配起来。所以,音乐配对这个观念不是⋯⋯而是,当你听到特别的声音,喝着特别的啤酒,可以将两者联姻,创造出更丰富的体验,譬如⋯⋯这一点已经为牛津大学这一研究领域执牛耳者所证实,高频音乐、高频节奏能够强化甜蜜的感觉。所以,知道了这一点,并尝试着利用它,你便能强化你的音乐体验的风味,对我们而言,这个实验非常有趣,我们想进一步参与其中⋯⋯上星期我们有机会去牛津大学和胃理学大师Charles Spence对谈,我认为品酒方式,或说品尝任何事物的方式,打开了一扇全新的窗户,所以我们很希望能够引领这一口味冒险。我们不会忽视科技,相反,我们会利用科技来开发酿酒技术。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">譬如,我们跟乐队、音乐家合作,譬如英国乐队Editors,我们合作,用他们的声音和我们的啤酒共同创造。我们聚到一起,讨论,理解彼此的想法,理解是什么促使他们写歌,然后就有了这种合作,一种几乎全新的尝试⋯⋯我们讨论了口味,讨论了音乐,我们一步步深入理解彼此,然后我们为他们酿酒,他们给我们反馈,基于这份样品,我们酿出了我们称之为&ldquo;拯救&rdquo;(Salvation)的一款啤酒,我想,啤酒匹配音乐让他们很开心,但不仅仅是声音,而是声音中的精神,所以⋯⋯非常有趣,为了让你更明白&mdash;&mdash;你可以想象有声音的词语,每个词都有声音,而每个声音都有味道,如果我给出BUBA和KICKY这两个词,你会认为它们是一样的吗?当你听到BUBA时你产生什么样的想象?</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>So you are making</strong><strong>&nbsp;new face, new taste, new&hellip;to beer, and you are also trying to do synesthesia, can you give us more details about that?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">That is an area of focus for us now, and we are developing our&nbsp;execution&nbsp;in this, we can talk about Gastrophysics and Synesthesia, so it&#39;s this kind of cross of sensorial experiences where we can look at musical pairing for instance when you have sound that is matching your &mdash; the&mdash;beer. So musical pairing is the idea that it&#39;s not&hellip;when you have specific sound, specific beer, and then the two marry together, and create more of the experience, so for instance&hellip; it&#39;s been proved in Oxford University leading the part in this, the high frequency music, high frequency rhythm would accentuate the feeling of sweetness, and the low frequency musical rhythm would accentuate the feeling of bitterness. So, knowing this, and playing with it you can accentuate favors of musical experiences on your paulette, so that&#39;s a very strong interest for us to look into this to experiment further&hellip;we had the chance to go to Oxford university last week to talk with Charles&nbsp;, with the&nbsp;Guru&nbsp;of the gastrophysics, I think it opens a whole new window of tasting beer, and tasting in general, so we are certainly willing to be pioneer in this adventure of taste. We are not&nbsp;shying away&nbsp;from technology and using science on top of the art of brewing.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">For instance, we work with bands, musicians, such as Editors, an British, on the collaboration, co-creation,&nbsp; with their sound, and our beer, and we met, we discuss, we understood where we are coming from, what motivated them to write their songs, and then there was this collaboration which was a also try on the air&hellip; we were talking about the taste, we were talking about the music, and we were step by step building a better understanding of each other, then we brew one beer and they get, give us some feed-back, and we worked on this version and then I had the beer which we called the&nbsp;<em>Salvation</em>, and I think they are very happy with how the beer was matching, not just sound but the spirit of the sound, so &hellip; very interesting, for you maybe to understand, you know, it&#39;s, you can imagine that even words have sounds, every word has a sound, and every sound has a taste, if I ask you BUBA and KICKY, do you think BUBA and KICKY taste the same? What would you imagine when you think about BUBA?</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>我完全不知道它们的意思?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:没有意思,只是声音。只是一个词,一个声音,它没有意义。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>I have no idea about the meaning of&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">It has no meaning, it&#39;s just a sound. It&#39;s a word and it&#39;s a sound, but it has no meaning.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">BUBA?</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:BUBA。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">BUBA?</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">BUBA.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>我的第一反应是想到了热带古巴,这声音很温热,潮湿,而KICKY的调子有点儿高,所以⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:你觉得哪一个更甜蜜?忘掉古巴,因为它不是古巴,不是岛屿,而是BUBA。它的发音是BUBA,它没有意义,只是一个声音而已,听起来像BUBA的声音而已。KICKY,也没有意义,也只是一个声音。哪一个让你觉得更圆润,或说偏甜?</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">KICKY偏甜,更圆润?有趣。对我而言是BUBA,它简直就像是热情的拥抱。我感觉它是一种很圆润的形式,而KICKY则⋯⋯感觉挺直,它偏酸,有一点苦涩。它没有BUBA的那种舒适感,BUBA的感觉非常惬意,BUBA的舒适感又我想到某种圆润的东西,带着非常美妙的惬意感,而KICKY里头则有某种让你感到苦涩味道的东西。我不知道为什么,也许中国人们对此有不同的反应,很可能这种反应当中有文化因素的强烈影响,这不仅仅是生物的,也是文化的,你有不同的想法,这一点很有意思。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Actually what I first respond to the words is that I think of Cuba which is a tropical area, the sound is warm and humid, that picky is a little bit high pitch? (yes), so&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">So which one would you say that is sweet? Get away from Cuba, because it&#39;s not Cuba, it&#39;s not an island, it&#39;s about BUBA. It sounds BUBA, it has no meaning, it&#39;s just a sound, it&#39;s just a sound of BUBA. And Kicky. Kicky has no meaning, it&#39;s just a sound as well. Which one you think is more rounded, and more, maybe, on the sweet side?</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Kicky would be more sweet and rounded? That&#39;s funny. For me it&#39;s BUBA, because BUBA has this &hellip;.I feel like it&#39;s warm, when I think of BUBA, I almost think&nbsp;of a big hug.&nbsp;I see, it&#39;s well rounded form, while KICKY&nbsp;is again indeed&hellip; it&#39;s more like straightened, it&#39;s more like going sour, maybe a little bit bitterness. But it doesn&#39;t have the comforts of BUBA, BUBA seems to be very comfy, the comfiest of BUBA make me think something again well rounded, with a very nice&nbsp;cosiness, and KICKY I think it&#39;s you know it is something that makes you maybe a little bit astringency in the word KICKY.&nbsp; But I don&#39;t know maybe in China people would react different to what was not&hellip;but most possible that there is also a very strong cultural element in the reaction, it&#39;s not just biological, it&#39;s also cultural, so that&#39;s actually very interesting that you think different.&nbsp;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>我也认为个人背景和情绪会起到某种作用⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:是的,当然。不,不,个人因素会产生影响,但仍然⋯⋯我们说远了,这是题外话⋯⋯但是如果你问一百个比利时人,他们不知道这些词,但我相信大部分人都会说BUBA是圆润的。我非常好奇,如果你问一百个中国人同样的问题,他们会说什么⋯⋯</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>I think also the personal background and emotion could play&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Yes, of course. No, no, I think personal plays, but still&hellip;we are a little bit off the interview now&hellip; but if you ask one hundred Belgium people the BUBA and KICKY, they don&#39;t know the words, but I think most of them would say the well rounded is BUBA. I&#39;m very curious if you ask the same question one hundred Chinese people, what they would say&hellip;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><u><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>KICKY⋯⋯</strong><strong>更甜蜜,BUBA更温暖,可爱⋯⋯</strong></span></u></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:但如果说味道呢⋯⋯</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">K<strong>ICKY&hellip; is sweeter, BUBA is warm, cute yeah&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">But in terms of taste&hellip;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><u><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>BUBA的味道有点儿苦涩,有点儿⋯⋯但不是很苦涩,只是有那么一点儿。KICKY在想象中像是PINKY(粉红色)⋯⋯</strong></span></u></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:非常有趣,事实上也非常&ldquo;文化&rdquo;,你们可能有一种自孩童时代的见闻所形成的强烈的集体性想象,这会产生影响,然后引发联想,当然你会进行联想,词语的联想,声音的联想,但心理方面也是让人非常好奇的,这是为什么你可以认为它一定不只是生物性的,它更是&mdash;&mdash;很大程度上是&mdash;&mdash;心理性的。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>The taste of BUBA is a little bit bitter, a little bit&hellip; not too much, just a little. Kicky is like pinky, that&#39;s the imagination&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Yes, that&#39;s very funny, that&#39;s very cultural indeed, you maybe there is also a play of very collective imagination that comes with what you could have seen in your childhood, that could influence, and then the association, because of course you make association, word association, sound association, but psychological aspect was very intriguing, and that&#39;s why you can see it is not very necessarily biological, it&#39;s more, it&#39;s lots of psychological.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>也许未来我们可以在中国问问同样的问题,特别是那些喝你们的酒的人⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:一定。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>We can talk more about this in the future, we can do this in China, when people drink your beer, we can ask the question&nbsp;</strong>&hellip;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Yes. Absolutely.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>刚才你谈到了跟音乐的关联。在这里我们可以听到很多种音乐,</strong><strong>其他地区</strong><strong>,</strong><strong>譬如土耳其音乐⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:我们很想⋯⋯这是个好主意,但我们现在还没有这样的计划。这里不只有土耳其人,还有很多摩洛哥人,很多人是不喝酒的,穆斯林传统不让他们喝酒,所以,我得说,我们还没有涉及所有我们可以涉及的音乐,但我觉得你的问题不是无关的,现在,我们所合作的大多数是独立音乐,电子音乐,如果未来能够同少数族裔的音乐合作会非常不错,我们肯定不会忽视它们,再一次,我要说,我们对非常文化的方法持有开放态度,但我们还没有和这种可说是新东方音乐的类型合作。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Just now you talked about you make connection with music, here we hear a lot of music, from other regions, like Turkish music&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">We would love to&hellip;It&#39;s very good idea, at the moment we didn&#39;t do it yet. There is just not Turkish, there&#39;s also a lot of people from Morocco, and a lot of those people who don&#39;t drink alcohol, so Muslim tradition makes them not drink alcohol,&nbsp; so I have to say, we don&#39;t have as much as connection as could, but I think your question is very relevant, at this moment ,we work mostly with indie rock, and electronic music, it would be very good to work with more ethnic music in the future, and we certainly not shy away from that, we are open again to a very much cultural approach, but we haven&#39;t worked with this kind of maybe new Eastern music.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>昨天我们经过了一座广场,那里有人播放不同的音乐,他们用随声喇叭播放音乐,一方是土耳其的,另一方是来自另外一个穆斯林地区,非常有趣⋯⋯</strong><strong>也许未来你们可以尝试着在中国的音乐和你们的口味之间做个配对⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:当然,我得说,得再次说明,我不是中国音乐的专家,但我非常乐意了解更多,看看未来有什么可以做的。我确信中国有很另类的音乐场景,非常有活力,非常实验,我希望有机会去接触,更深入理解中国音乐的精神⋯⋯</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Because yesterday we passed a square, we saw there was a competition between different music, they play them loud with small sound equipment, one may be from Turkey, the other from other Muslim country, very interesting&hellip;Maybe in the future you can make connection between Chinese music and your taste&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Of course, I have to say, I have to say that again I&#39;m not huge specialist of Chinese music, I would love to learn more about it and see what could be done, I&#39;m sure there is also an alternative scene, that is very vibrant, very experimenting, and so we would love to get in touch, and get more understanding of spirit of Chinese music&hellip;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>也许未来可以去少数民族地区看看⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:好啊,我曾去过中国一次,我也很想再去看一看。事实上,要是能回去看看它发展了多少,更新了多少,我会非常兴奋,中国是一个非常让人兴奋的国家。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Maybe in the future we can invite you to visit some ethnical areas&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Yeah, now, I mean,&nbsp;I had been there once&nbsp;and I&rsquo;d like to see China again. Actually, I think it&#39;s high time for me to go back to see how much it evolved, and how much it has grown since, certainly a very exciting country.&nbsp;&nbsp;</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>跟你在中国未来的啤酒爱好者说说你对中国的看法⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:我要说,我对中国的看法,很大程度上是我上一次在中国旅行时形成的⋯⋯就像今天早上我说的,我当时兴奋不已,今天我还确切记得,那是在十年前在上海⋯⋯这个城市充满了活力,充满了能量,建筑破土而出的场面,让人感慨它就像是19世纪30年代大变动中的纽约⋯⋯我认为中国有这种强大的创新天性,她也有非常强大的手工艺历史。当然,从文化角度来说,这个国家是很复杂的,你可能要把中国当作大陆来看待,而不只是一个国家,她具有广泛的多样性,你无法将它看成是&ldquo;一个&rdquo;中国,你们肯定有非常强大的融合又多样的传统,需要很多年才能透彻理解。最肯定的是,她是一个非常特别的国家,一个会吸引你多次造访的国家。我还没有谈到食物呢⋯⋯我享受了很多美食盛宴,盼着早日再去!</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Maybe you can tell your beer lovers in China about your idea about China?</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">My idea of China,&nbsp;I&#39;d say,&nbsp;my idea of China was mostly the idea I made when I was traveling&hellip;I was very excited, I was telling you this morning, I remember still today, being in Shanghai that was ten years ago, exactly ten years ago&hellip; It was very dynamic, a lot of energy, that was very good to see the building were coming out of the ground, and I felt that it felt like being in New York City in the 1930s, that something major was happening&hellip; I think China has this strong creative nature &amp; a strong history of craftsmanship too. It is certainly complicated from the cultural point and you probably have to approach China as a continent, not really like a country, it&#39;s also very diverse, you can&#39;t think of that it&#39;s just one China, it&#39;s sure you have very strong mixed and diverse traditions within China and it would take so many years to start understanding it. Most certainly, it&#39;s a very special country, one that invites you to come to visit more. And I&rsquo;m not talking about food yet&hellip;I had so many good feasts, and looking forward to going back!</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>你们跟非政府组织也有合作,用食物&mdash;面包&mdash;酿酒⋯⋯</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:是的,我们跟布鲁塞尔的食物行动者有接触,其中一个组织刚做了一份调查,结果显示面包是被浪费最多的食品。在布鲁塞尔,估计每一周会有多达数吨的面包被浪费掉,要知道,布鲁塞尔是个小城市,比起中国的城市,简直是小巫见大巫。那么,想象一下,这里发生了多少浪费,在商店,在面包房,在家里有多少面包被浪费了。于是我们就有了一次讨论,然后我们决定,用这些面包来酿酒应该会非常有意思。七千年前面包就被用来酿酒了,为什么我们今天不试一试呢?当然,是酿当代的面包啤酒。接着我们就开始了,我们以一种非常DIY的方式进行试验。刚开始时我们犯了好多错误,效果不佳,后来我们得到了在一所大学做研究,现在是我们研发部门主管的Antonie的帮助,我们继续试验,酿了更多的样品,然后突然我们就取得了关键性进展,终于用面包酿出了很不错的啤酒,现在这个项目仍在继续,而现在我们也仍然在和NGO保持着日常合作。他们每天会帮我们收集面包,大概一个月一顿的样子,每一瓶Babylon,也就是这一瓶,当中会有两片面包。我很满意这个项目,可以说,这是世界上的第一款&ldquo;浪费食物啤酒&rdquo;,这对我们很有好处,就像今天早上告诉你们的,给我们带来了不少的可见度。Jamie Oliver,一位英国厨师,邀请我们到伦敦进行了一场展示会, 他也是伦敦一款面包啤酒的出资人,所以,现在,这款啤酒变得很受欢迎,我们还很想做更多,获得更多的乐趣,酿更多的Babylon,回收更多的面包,跟NGO进行更多的合作,创造更多的就业机会,这对这个NGO也有好处。我们会延伸这个想法,我很高兴看到很多不同城市的酿酒师都用到了这个想法,酿造他们自己的食物啤酒,我们没有⋯⋯我们秉持开源哲学,我们没有必要保守专利,所以我们跟伦敦的酿酒师分享酿造方法,所以我们⋯⋯所以我很高兴看到Babylon的小兄弟小姐妹的出生。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>You have some connections with NGO, making beer with food, bread&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Yes, we&rsquo;re in touch with food activists in Brussels, and one of them had just made a study that showed that the bread was the no.1 food element that was wasted, and in Brussels, we&rsquo;re&nbsp;talking about&nbsp;tons of breads every week, and Brussels is just a small city of one million people, compared to the Chinese cities, it&#39;s super small. So imagine how much waste, how much waste in the shops, in bakeries, and at home as well. We have thisdiscussion, and say, hey, maybe we could have fun to make beer out of these bread, and&hellip;after all, the system of beer is fermented bread, so it&#39;s way to do it some seven thousand years ago, and why not we about to do it today, you know, but of course new modern bread beer, and then, ok, we started it, we started experimenting on this very do it yourself, you know, DIY approach. We made a lot of mistakes (in) the first trying the bread and it didn&#39;t work too well, then we got help from&nbsp;Antoine&nbsp;who was working as a research in a university and became the head of research and development department here for us, and we worked more about it again, we made more prototypes, and suddenly we started to make some progress into using the bread and making it to nice beer, and now the project is still alive and now we also still work with NGO on the day-to-day basis, every day they collect bread for us, and we collect about one&nbsp;ton&nbsp;of breads per month, and in every bottle of the Babylon, here is the beer, you have two slices of bread, so now very happy with this project, it&#39;s the first food waste beer, as we say in the world, and it was good for us, and it also attracted a lot of visibility, I was telling you this morning &hellip;&nbsp;Jamie Oliver&nbsp;, a British chief, made a special show and invited us to London, he was actually the sponsor of London-based bread beer as well, so now it&#39;s been a great beer, and we are looking actually to do more on this fun, to do more with Babylon, recycle more breads, work more with NGO, so thus create more jobs, for this NGO as well, and maybe extend this notion, I&#39;m very happy also to see all brewers in different cities take this idea, bread, and make their own, so and we don&#39;t have&hellip;we have open sources philosophy, we don&#39;t necessarily have patent on how to make it, so we just share it with London-based brewers, so we have&hellip;so I&#39;m very happy to see little brothers and sisters of Babylon, little babies of Babylon coming to life.</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><u><strong>酷,所以你们的开源哲学意味着⋯⋯你们会对配方分享对象设定标准吗?</strong></u></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">塞:是,人们必须严肃,他们必须怀有责任感,他们必须真诚行事。Babylon不是为了赚钱,它的关键在于回收利用面包,用它来酿造不一样的啤酒,让人们更关切食物浪费这个问题,这样的话,我们就会很开心地分享它。希望它能够如涓涓细流,一个接一个地流传开去。当然,你想得到,我们自己无法亲自去跟每个人分享,但希望我们会像多米诺牌一样,每个人都能分享,每个人都能从中学会更多,但总的来说,尤其这是因为我们关注的是食物浪费问题,所以,我觉得保护你的发现毫无意义,而分享它才是有意义的。</span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif"><strong>Cool, so your open resources it means that&hellip; do you have any standard for those who want to use the formulation&hellip;</strong></span></p> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p> <p style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,Times,&quot;儷宋 Pro&quot;,&quot;LiSong Pro&quot;,&quot;細宋體&quot;,SimSun,&quot;新宋體&quot;,&quot;宋体&quot;,NSimSun,serif">Yeah, the people have to be serious, they have to be committed, and they have to be genuine in their approach. Babylon is not to make money, the Babylon point is to create special beer with recycle bread, and create more Sensibilization about this topic of food waste, and there we are happy to share. And hopefully it can trickle down and we share to one, we share to another one, we share to another one. Because of course you can imagine we cannot share ourselves with everyone, but hopefully we will be the dominos &mdash;&nbsp; everybody can share and everybody can learn more about it, but overall, especially you&#39;re taking about food waste, I think it makes no sense to try to protect your discovery, rather you want to share&hellip;</span></p> <hr /> <p style="text-align:justify">&nbsp;</p>